MSM Mob justice prevails, even with reform-minded police chiefs. The article is sympathetic to their plight. Glad NYT has the ability to tolerate that perspective as much as it is given to the first paragraph. How many split seconds does a police officer have to decide that her/his life is in danger? "Instant replay' is great. Grieving widows missing the sound of opening velcro?
If police chiefs were properly disciplining their employees, job security would actually be fairly easy to come by. It really isn't that hard to not kill citizens that aren't posing a mortal danger to you or others. But brutality continues to be a problem because leadership, and police as a community, appear to have a huge problem with accountability.
Im surprised that the comments here don't seem to mention that the Minneapolis police chief is a black man while the Atlanta police chief was a white woman. Even though the death of George Floyd was a complete murder with no caveats, the chief was not pressured to resign. Meanwhile, a controversial killing of a black man in Atlanta, led to the resignation of the police chief within 24 hours while the mayor of Atlanta is publicly celebrated. She happens to be black. Could it really be that white police chiefs are being held accountable (as they should be) while black police chiefs are getting a pass? I would prefer if all races of police chief were held accountable. It also didn't escape me that the replacement for this white woman police chief is a black male officer. I don't think the solution here is just to make all police chiefs black men. I think the key here is to restructure the police of any race so they actually serve their citizens.
If you can't run your organization should you have job security? If your a dangerous cop should you have job security? The Fish rots from the head down. We act like these folks were made to become cops.They don't conscript cops and their bosses. If you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen.If you promise to reform before you get the job you should get the boot if you don't reform. Don't make promises that you can't keep.There are already to many chiefs whose affinity is more with the rank and file than the people they serve.
@Steven McCain ,,,You think you can do better, Steven? Join the force and work your magic. You'll find the same thing most of these police chiefs did, entrenched police unions whose only job is to protect cops, innocent or otherwise.
“Police Chiefs Are Finding Job Security Is Hard to Come By”... ..,, and soon the rank and file Police themselves will be finding Job Security hard to Come By ... .... and soon average Citizens will be finding “Security” hard to come by ... .... No security ...No Businesses... No Businesses ... No Jobs... No Jobs ... No Income ... No Income ... No Society .., ...after that ... No Lives will Matter...
Wow. Officer Rolfe was fired and Chief Shields resigns within 24 hours of the incident, all before an investigation by GBI barely gets underway. "Due process" for law enforcement just got flushed down the sewer. So now Officer Rolfe is unemployed, guilty in the MSM and public eye, and faces a major politically charged internal investigation, to be followed by a criminal charge (believe me you can bet the house on that), and a civil lawsuit. No doubt that ATL Mayor is behind all of this in order to protect her political image with city and constituents, along with her rising image in the DNP. Blue - you face potential danger every day as public service, but have been shamelessly abandoned by spineless politicians who respond to protester signs and social media standings.
@Chef Kevin Where was the due process for the deceased? Where was the due process for Mr Floyd? Power lineman have a more dangerous job are they allowed to shoot people in the back ?
Good -- the quickest way to modify behavior is to make sure officers and supervisors know their job, pension, benefits etc. might be on the line. Just like they are for the rest of us.
@Pat This article is explaining that officers and supervisors DO know their jobs, and what punishments they could receive or dole out as a consequence for THEIR decisions that are too frequently deadly for the general public. The problem is the police unions/guilds have completely neutered the ability of those hired to marshal reforms. Unions/guilds have written their contracts with local government to protect police despite provable bad behavior. These contracts combined with laws like Qualified Immunity (which the unions spent millions lobbying for) have made it impossible for police chiefs in the majority of cities to actually do anything about this problem. So there are no repercussions—these cops almost never lose their jobs, they move to a new town. They don't lose their pensions—even if they he convinced the murder of George Floyd will still receive his pension. But they almost never go to jail. They get paid to sit at home while under an investigation that was never going to really hurt them in the first place.
@Pat And the most obvious way to see the result you desired is to call the police and they turn up after half a hour after the assailants are long gone. You know, the police are people too and they don’t have to put their lives on the line if you aren’t going to back them up. They can be social workers and meter maids. They don’t have to stop crime in progress, they don’t have to keep the peace, they don’t have to come rescue you. If you are fine with having no police that will respond to violent crimes that’s ok, the rest of us that worries about such things will just buy guns and carry.
@Pat , really you lose your job if an employee breaks the law?
I am strongly in favor of Unions. We need them and need to expand their reach. There is no better way I know to ensure workers are treated and compensated fairly. However, I do not agree with Unions that exert their power to deny entities the ability to rid themselves of those who do not meet the necessary standards or do not support the goals of the organization where they work. Police unions are the new poster child for Unions out of control. In this case they are responsible for the many instances prohibiting the Police organizations from dealing with problem officers or instituting reforms. A new police chief should be able to place into leadership positions those who support them and the reforms they are trying to implement. Individuals like the head of the New York police union are as biased as they come and are a complete impediment to reasonable policies and reforms. There must be a change in the contracts negotiated that lessens the power of these unions (can't believe I'm even writing this) or there will never be the necessary reforms implemented throughout the profession.
Police chiefs are as fungible as NFL head coaches. 90% of them don't make a whit bit of difference in their department's trajectory.
Ridiculous and the public can blame their own twitter-judgement mentality! You bring in someone new and you don't even give them a chance to do anything before you scream and cry for their head to roll. Our entire country has been taken over by this bizarre notion that "justice" is watching the head of the person at the top role whether or not they have anything to do with the situation at hand. The quality of our public servants is going to deteriorate and deteriorate as less and less people are even willing to step up and accept these leadership positions. Oh, but wait, defund the police anyway? The internet has ruined the world; it has robbed people of any sense of proportion or any time to think clearly. Media flash/public clamor/head roll. Rinse. Repeat. To what end?
Oh my god, how much louder can we be? We don't want reform, we want defunding. We're not "increasingly critical of police tactics and behavior," we're enraged at killer cops and the institutions that protect them, and want them gone. I am deeply disappointed every day by the media's watered down reporting on the BLM movement.
One piece of information that is curiously absent from this and other articles on police chiefs stepping down (or being fired) is what, if any parachute they have when leaving. Do we know, and what is it made of? Given the example set by CEOs of businesses, I wouldn't be surprised if the fall from grace is cushioned by silken pillows.
When the police try to arrest you and you grapple with the police and fight back , what do you expect?
Jack Webb for national police commissioner. The rest have been too Dum Da Dum Dum.
Police officer earn in their lifetime about what most doctors earn excluding proceduralists who bill for large numbers of procedures. These doctors are outliers like police chiefs. Doctors start later because of the years of training and they work a lot more years but police officers have a short period of work and a long period of pensions. Apparently there is a move to set up a national data bank like there is for doctors. It might make sense to require police officers to carry malpractice insurance which they pay for. Officers who lose too many cases would end up with massive premiums that would drive them out of practice. Officers who were too old or who did not continue their training with documentation would be subject to premium surcharges. The Continuing Education would be off the clock and at their expense just like doctors. Police are dealing with life and death as are doctors. Police malpractice kills people and not just black men. Twice as many white men are killed by police every year. The taxpayer does not assume the malpractice liabilities of doctors and it is hard to see why the taxpayer should assume the liabilities of police officers. Both are acting in a public safety setting and often the doctor is not paid if the patient is indigent or uninsured but the doctor is still subject to significant and often greater malpractice risk if there is a bad outcome.
Whether what we are experiencing, and witnessing, is unnecessary reactive violence by diverse “control agents,” in various contexts and environments, or failures in effective responses to targeted behaviors by individuals and groups, expecting a governor, mayor, or police chief, however experienced, to “solve” THE “problem” without active, daily, partnering with an active public is lying to ourselves! Without, for example, an active US, diverse in many personal characteristics, beliefs, behaviors, roles,and types,levels and qualities of internal and external resources for daily coping, adapting and functioning, while sharing many commonalities, effectively challenging rooted, historically enabled and nurtured WE-THEY violating cultures is not likely. Options for necessary viable changes, temporary or more permanent ones, include, for example, the semantics used. Police unions, a legally created entity with delineated functions, are not THE barrier to changing police associated killings and other violence.People with roles, names, etc.are THE “accountables,” as are the people in the cultures, communities, and neighborhoods which have and which continue to seed, nourish and enable that those people mandated to protect them are now violating them.With the impunity derived from passive to more active types, levels and qualities of citizen-collaboration! Changing police chiefs doesn’t “immunize” against OUR own toxic,unaccountability and its willful blindness.Deafness.Silence.
What a horrible turn of events. But critics of the police here should accept the possibility that this officer was following protocols that are put in place as GENERAL practices designed for ranges of situations. (Nuremberg defenses fell flat because the overall or average application of followed protocols was terribly wrong.) Such categorical practices of our police (which necessarily result in some misapplication) would probably not become more fine-grained and fair if law enforcement is defunded. If every brutal misappropriation of police procedure can result in violent and destructive backlash that depends largely on media and political context rather than the actual event (and evidence related to it) then the prospects for long-term constructive change seem dim. Before questioning whether many of our dehumanizing police protocols are excessive or poor we should acknowledge that some such protocols are necessary in law enforcement where risks, time constraints and emotional intensity do not allow for well-crafted decision trees. Accepting this as well as 'some' anecdotal injustice and brutality, imo, is important to advance VERY needed reforms that embrace difficult realities. Rationally maturity (that maintains compassion) and non-group thinking is really needed here... and many places these days.
End Public Sector Unions and watch how quickly policing and teaching improves.
What difference does it make to them: they leave their jobs with HUGE lifetime pensions at Police Chief payscale. Police Chiefs only bother to hold their positions for an average of 3-5 years anyhow since they can retire millionaires under our corrupt Pension System
I really wish that police chief were being held accountable. The incompetent and disgraced Medaria Arradondo is still serving as the Chief of the Minneapolis Police Department. His dismissal is paramount for failures to provide the oversight, training, and discipline to ensure the safety of all citizens. His removal is paramount to reform!
The disparity of law enforcement is an issue which requires to be rectified. Please note I am a Latino conservative man. Although it may not be necessarily an issue of racism, per se, it is certainly an issue of an adversarial relationship between police departments and the people they are supposed to serve. I participated in a similar situation as Mr. Brooks a few years back. A friend was drunk at the parking lot of a Carl's Junior restaurant, the police officers allowed my friend to call a friend to drive him home. I grabbed another friend to to drive his car back home. Everybody walked away, the only person affected was my friend's bruised ego. He was mortified the for the next few weeks. Yes, he is white. If he wasn't white, he would have been arrested. Period. I would like to believe the officers where not racist, both of them white. In the case of Mr. Brooks last Friday in Atlanta, I believe this was an act of revenge. A black man kicked two officers behind and add insult to injury, he ran away with one of the officer's taser. There was only outcome for his transgression: his life. As a minority, I know the outcome of having a bad driving record. A drunk driving violation means a poor livelihood or middle class livelihood. Our existence and prospects of a better future is that feeble. Mr Brooks, In his drunken stupor he knew this. The officers had many choices last Friday, but they didn't exercised any of them and as a result a man, a dad, a son, a brother is dead.
This country is turning into South Africa (not from South Africa but I have family in South Africa so I can say that). Look at that photo with the guy holding up “Stop killing us” sign. That’s a looted Wendy’s in the background presumably where the shooting took place. Why would you smash up a Wendy’s that have nothing to do with the police? Now the community is going to lose a restaurant, dozens of workers will go home, and the guy that invested into that community is going to lose a chunk of his investment. Stop looting and rioting. This “fight the power” mentality might have carried black power movement far beyond what Hispanic, Asian, Indian, Native American have achieved but is also the reason police respond in force. Most people, especially those with money and power, want the police to act with force to keep everything from burning. I really don’t know how they don’t understand it is counterproductive to fighting the police at every opportunity and having songs celebrating killing the police isn’t helping.
Why should they be any different from the rest of us?
@Jeffrey Gillespie because nobody calls for Jeff Bezos to resign if their Amazon delivery is late.
@Dave Larson did you just compare managing systemic violence to getting your Amazon package late?
The problem the police face is one of efficacy as much as bias. They have to do a better job of catching miscreants while also doing a better job of protecting everyone else, from criminality and from the police themselves. It would be too easy to turn up the heat on criminals by just turning up the heat. That's what Stop and Frisk did. It would be equally easy to back off and let a few more miscreants get away in order to avoid injury and insult to the innocent. Neither of those solutions will do. There is too much crime already, and the American public and the rest of the world will not put up with the level of injury and insult that has been happening to the innocent, especially to black people. Changing their focus will not do the job. They have to be better at both, and that is much harder to do. Yet that is exactly what should be expected of a police chief.
Where is the liberal outrage over running a gay female in a traditionally male job out on a rail (I looked and that phrase doesn't appear to have any non-PC connotation)? I guess George Orwell was right, "some are more equal than others."
Of course the joke (sick one at that) is when the LA police chief retired, received one million dollars for doing so and the was rehired the next day.
It's the police union chiefs and the terms of police union agreement that need to fired and renegotiated, not the police chiefs per se. The police chiefs and police union chiefs are not the same person. In Minneapolis, it's police union President Lt. Bob Kroll, who has a history of racist and unprofessional policing, that contributed to the culture of policing and 'legal immunity' that led to the death of George Floyd. Erika Shields appeared to be a highly progressive and thoughful police chief who is a sacrificial lamb firing for the Mayor. This is a lousy forced resignation/firing by Atalanta Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms.
We have allowed the police like we have allowed our congressmen and women to keep corralling black Americans years after years instead of doing the right thing ourselves. Police unions need to stop intimidating like organized crime group and states need to be able to purge themselves of repeated offenders
There are several organizations such as fire, ATC, and hospitals, that pay homage to superior rankings and the linear chain of command required for military precision. Even though the staff name, chief, has been mostly eliminated for PC reasons the duties remain. Those duties are training, discipline, and point of delivery oversight so as to ensure quality service. Medaria Arradondo’s, Chief of the Minneapolis Police Department, performance failed in all major critical duties of his position, therefore his immediate removal is required.
Let's see, Minneapolis has been completely controlled by Democrat Mayors and City Councils for almost 50 years, Chicago the same for well over 50 years, On the West Coast LA, SF, Portland, Seattle pretty much the same situation for many years and Administrations now. All of the Policies, Procedures training standards, hiring and firing are written and enforced by Democrats. Maybe Democrats aren't the problem and we just need to allow a few more decades for their values sink in to the Police and the public.
The more I understand the union’s role in the policies covering systemic abuse and murder of constituents at the hands of police, the more I am convinced that the movement to defund the police is spot on. This system is rotten through and through, starting with elected officials desire to accommodate union bosses instead of the voters.
Police in this country is all messed up and nobody have the will to really fix it. Chiefs sometimes are accountable to the Mayor but some times they are not, then the Chiefs have to go through what seems the powerful police union to discipline anybody. Anytime a chief comes in and starts promising something, they are lying, they don't have the power, they are just saying to the mayor, something happens, I will take the fall for you. The rank&file are not the problem, the buck police seems to stop with the union and nobody want to touch it. Keep saying reform doesn't do anything.
Nobody, including police unions should be permitted to demand that policies that lead to needless killings of citizens (who may or may not be guilty of a crime) should not be changed. If such unions, after repeated incidents of killings and brutality, resist or block the necessary reforms, then they should be disbanded, charged with violating the civil rights of ordinary citizens, and, if possible, even tried for aiding and abetting the brutality by the rank and file officers.
Perhaps that's because in most cases, police unions actually have much more power than the Chief of Police.
Focusing the accountability on the chief to transform the department is exactly why these typical reform efforts don't work. In municipalities, the chief and the city manager are usually shorter term positions and their job security is largely at the pleasure of the council and the public (as it should be). The police union, on the other hand, is the same year after year, entrenched, and a constant support of the old system, by contract. Like it or not, many officers continue to support the union leadership because they know the score: the union will be there long after the current chief and city administrator have moved on/been forced out. The only way to truly reform the system that allows police misconduct in the U.S. is going to have to be at the State and Federal levels, with new legislation that limits the power police unions have over misconduct matters and allows the early and quick removal of problem officers via a strict, clear code of accountability. The police unions should retain their wage and conditions bargaining power, but police misconduct issues are unique in that they have deadly consequences to public safety, so the need for systemic reform is too critical to allow the unions to continue to control the system. We need to think differently and make big changes to eliminate the status quo. Remember, agree with the decision or not, Regan fired the air traffic controllers. Radical, systemic change is possible.
If you can’t do the job, you shouldn’t take it. In too many municipalities, being chief is seen as the ultimate police department promotion, to be achieved by politics within the department. In fact, however, today’s police chief must be able to accomplish numerous and diverse goals in spite of the obstacles and limitations.
When a ship goes down, the captain is always at fault. This same mindset applied to police departments has been counterproductive. Give police chiefs power over police unions, provide them with the funding for officer education and monitoring, do not make police officers into quasi-mental health counselors or social workers, then have all parties with a stake in law enforcement list their expectations for police performance. Until then we are swiftly moving, we just don't know where we are.
This is exactly why police departments have to be dismantled. The toxic combination of politics, police unions who fight change and police chiefs with the lack of power force change make it impossible to fix the existing system. Replacing the police with a set of agencies to perform specialized coordinated functions like dealing with addicts, the homeless, domestic violence as well as dealing with crime to replace current police forces would break the institutional inertia that prevents real change.
You would still need police because none of these agencies will risk going in alone to any drug user or intoxicated persons home. It's unpredictable.
Is the problem in the police training or lack thereof of anti-bias training? Can't they revamp the curriculum at police academies? Are the police unions standing in the way? I don't see what could be so hard about this. Except maybe the lack of political will at the highest levels to see this through.
This illustrates why it is so important to begin the process of defunding police departments as they currently exist and reinventing a governmental department. A department that responds to violent crime appropriately and when needed, but has no role in many of current day police functions like addressing the use and possession of any substances, “school resource officers”, parking tickets, passing fake $20 bills, selling cigarettes or tamales or anything else without a license (many of these license regulations are completely unnecessary anyway), etc. In the process police unions could and should be abolished.
Tough times indeed for police chiefs. However, it points out that they can be fired as "management", much more easily than rank and file police. This is primarily because of Police Unions doggedly defending their members, even when said members repeatedly are repeatedly cited for poor decisions and behaviors that would suggested firing is the prudent course of action. Case in point, Mr Chauvin.
well, this is a "moment," and moments do not social change make. for the rest, the chiefs of police are already toys in the tides. they have no real power against the police unions. if this "moment" is going to mean anything, then it needs to mean a substantial reduction in the power of the police unions. like the catholic church, the unions protect bad actors, pure and simple. the unions stand for the job, not the mission, and they will protect the job to the limit. protect "serve and protect"? that's not up to the police unions, that's up to the protesters.
Psychologists have suggested that the likelihood of arrest and conviction rather than the severity of the sentence is what deters criminals. This is why people do not blatantly walk out of the supermarket eating an apple. The penalty is low but the chance of getting caught is high. Policemen who kill face a steep penalty but an incredibly slim chance of conviction. A regular pattern of arrest and convictions will essentially eliminate this problem. Qualified immunity has to end.
Who's really in charge? I worked for a small division of a multi-national corporation with a plant nearby. Management and the union had a toxic relationship. The plant manager was a helpless pawn caught between far-away executives and officials of a huge union. Neither side cared less about the plant. The worst abuse occurred when a union employee attacked another union member with a 2x4. The plant manager attempted to fire him, but the union stepped in. The attacker was fully reinstated within 3 days. The real problem lies with mayors, city councils, and police unions. Mayors and city councils need to stand up to the unions with absolute determination.
@Steve I completely agree. The responsibility for policing policies lie with mayors and city councils. Jacob Frey, the mayor of Minneapolis knew about the problems with the Minneapolis police, but did nothing. He and other majors that don't act to solve the problems should be voted out.
The problem isn’t Police Chiefs. The problem is Police Unions who protect bad cops, promote and provide “warrior trainings” and so on. We need Police Union reform ASAP.
The parallels with the Cultural Revolution in China are compelling. Once upon a time there were leaders who said, "The Buck Stops Here" and went to do what had to be done. Now the leaders are increasingly saying, "Lemme out a here."
We've moved into a situation where words are being used to create belief or outrage, even if those words are utterly disconnected from objective reality. In the recent Atlanta shooting the District Attorney said that a man who has just failed a DUI breathalizer test (objective reality) resisted arrest for DUI by fighting, punching and overwhelming the two arresting officers (objective reality) stealing one of the officer's taser weapon, then firing that stolen weapon at an officer while fleeing the scene (objective reality) "did not represent any threat to anyone" (actual quote.) If there was not "any threat to anyone" in the above videotaped scenario, what actual conduct would constitute a "threat"? Words have meaning and the words used by officials should bear some meaningful relationship to the events they purport to describe. Otherwise we are in Maoist reality where politically opportune frenzy makes anyone and everyone a target for unjust mob vengeance.
Giving an individual a badge a gun and a ticket book does not a law enforcement officer make. Placing the tools of military combat at the disposal of undertrained and makes little sense either. Police should also be tested for drug and steroid use as their use promotes aggressive behavior. The power we give police is not in balance with the screening training and education required to do the task we entrust them with.
Isn't is time to admit that FDR was correct in stating that collective bargaining is not compatible with running a municipal government? Police and teacher unions represent those workers and not the public. Until governments can take back control of the rules governing their workers, the few 'bad apples' will be protected by their unions!
@Donna Gray Then pay government employees at the same level as private employees like they do in Singapore. How much do private security, PI, bodyguards cost when you turn their hourly rates into monthly? Most people don’t volunteer to be in a shootout or the opposite side of a riot so how much do you want to pay private employees so they do? Maybe hire Black Water?
@Donna Gray No, Dems will never say it.
You'd have to be out of your mind to be a Chief of Police anywhere's in this country
@Darryl B. Moretecom Especially in a city run by Dems. You'll be the scapegoat.
@Darryl B. Moretecom I think a city in California just fired their 6 months in office white woman police chief because the mayor demanded an African American chief. At this point people can probably buy a chief position with the mayor.
This is an increasingly difficult job that will tend to push away many good candidates that we really need.
The problem is we have laws on the books that are by and large good ones. But those laws are not executed on a fair basis. It doesn't or shouldn't matter who persons are if you have laws. use them, EQUALLY!! Why are officers given the benefit of doubt when they didn't show the same for someone they killed or hurt. As far as police officers are concerned, perhaps an applicant should be hired only after some sort of psychological tests are given to decide if they have the temperament for the job. We go through the gun test, the strength test, and such. But on the streets, the most important part is how you handle yourself and some people are not equipped to discipline themselves. So, perhaps the order should be, fill out the application, take the scheduled test for employment, take a psyche test (a really good test) and have numerous variations on hand, then after that conduct an in-person interview and proceed from there Not saying it would be 100% perfect, but it might prevent a lot of problems in the aftermath. And don't forget about setting new boundaries for the union.
@marriea Is there evidence that procedures were not followed "equally" here?
@marriea The police do go through evaluation, trainings, and performance reviews. The thugs that want the benefit of the doubt don’t. Why would I take someone that’s drunk, fall asleep behind his wheels at a Wendy’s drive through, argued with the officers for 27 minutes, fought with 2 officers, grab the police taser, and tried to use it against the officers over police officers.